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2CPU.com » News » August 2004 » Intel's LGA 775 socket explored

Intel's LGA 775 socket explored

Posted by: BuyALambo on: 08/04/2004 05:21 PM [ Print | 9 comment(s) ]

The Inquirer has posted a two part article on Intel's new LGA 775 CPU packaging, and, in traditional Inq style, they are very informative and yet surprisingly entertaining.
EVERYONE KNOWS that Intel's new Socket 775 (LGA775) simply sucks, after all, it has to, could 1,000 people on 100 message boards all be wrong? It is something new and different from Intel, who has none of our best interests at heart, it simply must be a conspiracy. It is fragile, expensive, and does nothing that the old socket would not do. If you look at it cross-eyed, or god forbid, put in a CPU for a fourth time, the board will simply catch fire. Nothing good comes from it, trust the friendly anonymous posters, none of which have an axe to grind, honestly. Put away the tin foil hats people, it isn't any of the above. I read the same things you probably did, and talked to some of the same people you read about, and several more. I have heard just about every conspiracy theory out there, and I noticed something odd, no one asked Intel if they were true. What is even more disturbing is that amidst the armchair quarterbacking, or at least armchair Electrical Engineering, no one bothered to ask the question "Why is LGA775 better than s478"?
Part one can be had here, part two here.


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« AMD/Linux Based Thin Clients · Intel's LGA 775 socket explored · Friday DC Updates! - 080604 »

Comment

KalTorak
Registered User


Posts: 42
Joined: 2004-02-07

#31042 Posted on: 08/04/2004 11:21 PM
Hell, it's not MY fault nobody understands this - it's not as tho I haven't explained it before. :)

And although my "NOT SPEAKING FOR INTEL" hat must remain firmly in place, my EE skillz are a fair bit beyond "armchair". :)

Not Speaking For Intel.

Comment

Vuke69
Bitpimp



Posts: 341
Joined: 2001-03-16

#31043 Posted on: 08/05/2004 01:21 AM
There is one thing I dont understand, about all modern mainstream processors. And that is when power requirements increase, why do they keep adding power and ground pins by the hundreds? Arround a third to half of the pins on a modern processor are just for power and ground. Why dont they add a couple of giant lugs like they used to have on some large risc chips. It was either the alphas, mips, ultrasparcs, or power, I cant recall which at this time, but one of them had two big ass power lugs sticking out the top. Unless I am mistaken and those were just brain wave collectors or something. (good thing my brain it safe, in the motherly embrace of my tin foil hat :)

Anyone have a good answer?

Comment

jhaislet
"Let's Roll"



Posts: 3248
Joined: 2002-06-25

#31044 Posted on: 08/05/2004 01:59 AM
I agree, since the new P4's are pulling somewhere around ~140w EACH, why not put like 2 of those 3.5mm mini-jack (headphone) style plugs in the bottom/middle part of the CPU?

However, I think the small pins are there as part of the power distribution grid on the actual CPU. Each set of pins powers a specific part of the cpu logic. Without the many pins supplying voltage to specific parts, you would probably need more internal power planes, which also btw, would have to be physically larger to carry the increased current.

eg. Think if every home in the US was powered directly off a 765,000v transmission wire and the equipment required to step that down for each tap vs the normal way of stepping it off a 7,000-13,000v line to 110v/220v.

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Comment

KalTorak
Registered User


Posts: 42
Joined: 2004-02-07

#31045 Posted on: 08/05/2004 02:10 AM
Originally posted by Vuke69
There is one thing I dont understand, about all modern mainstream processors. And that is when power requirements increase, why do they keep adding power and ground pins by the hundreds? Arround a third to half of the pins on a modern processor are just for power and ground. Why dont they add a couple of giant lugs like they used to have on some large risc chips. It was either the alphas, mips, ultrasparcs, or power, I cant recall which at this time, but one of them had two big ass power lugs sticking out the top. Unless I am mistaken and those were just brain wave collectors or something. (good thing my brain it safe, in the motherly embrace of my tin foil hat :)

Anyone have a good answer?


Because the power and ground pins aren't simply about power delivery; they're also needed to provide "return paths" for the currents that flow around when the signal pins switch voltage levels.

To oversimplify a little bit, currents flow in loops (according to a rule called Kirchoff's Current Law.) The physical size (er, area) of the loop around which the current flows is part of what determines how inductive that current path is. The more inductive that path is, the more voltage that's required to change the amount of current flowing in the path (V = L di/dt).

SO, as the loop that the current follows gets bigger, the inductance of the loop gets bigger, as the inductance gets bigger, the "edge rate" of the signal transitions gets slower, and as that edge rate gets slower, it becomes more difficult to speed up the interface (and we all like fast interfaces.)

For reasons I'll gloss over here, the loop that's formed by current flowing into or out of a given signal pin will also flow out of or into the nearest ground or power pin (current's returning to the part through that pin, so if it's going into the signal pin, it's going out the power pin, or vice versa.)

So, to minimize that loop area, one tries to place ground or power pins near EVERY signal pin, especially high-frequency signal pins (since it's at higher frequencies where these inductances matter.)

And that's why ya need lots of ground and power pins, besides the actual bulk delivery of current. :)

Not Speaking For Intel.

Comment

Vuke69
Bitpimp



Posts: 341
Joined: 2001-03-16

#31046 Posted on: 08/05/2004 02:18 AM
Originally posted by jhaislet
However, I think the small pins are there as part of the power distribution grid on the actual CPU. Each set of pins powers a specific part of the cpu logic. Without the many pins supplying voltage to specific parts, you would probably need more internal power planes, which also btw, would have to be physically larger to carry the increased current.


I was under the assumption that these chips still had power distribution busses on the chip itself, and all the power pins went to the same place anyhow.

But after reading your post, and thinking about it for half a second, I realized that you are probably correct. The last processor that i ever had to deal with on an electrical level was a Zilog Z80. That was a 80 pin dip with a mere single Vcc and ground. I guess things have changed quite a bit since then.

Comment

KalTorak
Registered User


Posts: 42
Joined: 2004-02-07

#31047 Posted on: 08/05/2004 02:44 AM
Originally posted by Vuke69
I was under the assumption that these chips still had power distribution busses on the chip itself, and all the power pins went to the same place anyhow.


Mmm... that's true; power distribution for a given voltage rail on a chip is pretty universal, and even more so with power planes in the chip package. The answer's more what I was saying about high-speed signaling.

Not Speaking For Intel.

Comment

MichaelMR2
Eve Sucks :)



Posts: 1902
Joined: 2001-07-02

#31048 Posted on: 08/05/2004 06:39 PM
I like it..

I'm told it's only a matter of time till we have CPU's intergrated into the mobo

the other alternative seems to be the whole make everyont on the die thingy

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Comment

jonjayal
Experienced Duallie


Posts: 247
Joined: 2002-01-11

#31049 Posted on: 08/06/2004 01:48 AM
the other alternative seems to be the whole make everyont on the die thingy


..as AMD has done with the memory controller on the Opteron

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Comment

questionlp
the Cowardly Tech



Posts: 323
Joined: 2002-02-14

#31050 Posted on: 08/06/2004 08:03 PM
Parts III and IV of the Socket 775 article are up:

Part III: http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=17681
Part IV: http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=17709

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2CPU.com » News » August 2004 » Intel's LGA 775 socket explored