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Novell sets sights on 'complete Linux desktop'
Posted by: Jim_ on: 03/23/2004 03:02 PM [ Print | 67 comment(s) ]
Hooz let me know about this article over at C|Net regarding Novell setting their sights on a 'complete Linux desktop'.
The desktop Linux push will include software from SuSE Linux, the No. 2 Linux seller that Novell acquired in January for $210 million, and Ximian, the Linux desktop specialist that Novell acquired in August. Signaling the extent of the company's Linux commitment, Novell flew Linux founder and leader Linus Torvalds out to share the stage with Stone and Messman. He offered a brief comment on Novell's potential, saying, "You guys can be the next big thing." But he confined most of his remarks to Linux generalities.Check it out.
« Torvalds: Outside threats to Linux · Novell sets sights on 'complete Linux desktop'
· AMD outlines future Opteron security features »
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Hooz Administrator Posts: 2337 Joined: 2000-03-29 |
#27951 Posted on: 03/26/2004 08:10 AM
No. Not everyone who has gotten a virus is an idiot (Well...). All I'm saying is that by taking 5 minutes to check and uncheck some boxes in Outlook's settings goes a long way towards keeping virii out. Couple that with a decent anti-virus package and some common sense and you're golden. You can look at software security like a you would a car. Some cars come with locked doors, others require you to lock them yourself. Just don't bitch when your CD player is missing because you forgot to lock the doors. As for the worm of the week with Outlook/OE/IE... It's a sad fact that if a "hacker" can write a worm that can infect Outlook/OE/IE users (Probably 70% of the total online community) they will. It's the biggest bang for the proverbial buck. That doesn't mean that any other package is any more or less secure. They aren't targeted as much, so how do you really tell if they're more secure? I guess I just get tired of all the anti-Microsoft rhetoric. If you find a tool that works better for you, more power to you. Just don't run around bashing other tools. They might be equally as useful to someone else. [size=1][url="http://www.2cpu.com"]2CPU.com[/url] - Because two are always better than one! Are you folding? [url="http://folding.extremeoverclocking.com/team_summary.php?s=&t=3074"]2CPU.com Folding@Home Team[/url] [url="http://www.heatware.com/eval.php?id=19979"]My Heatware[/url][/size] |
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rmn oh my, it's huge! Posts: 6013 Joined: 2002-01-26 |
#27952 Posted on: 03/26/2004 10:31 PM
The problem is when your car has an unlockable door in a place you don't know about, that will automatically open for whoever walks by. I think the sentence "malicious code execution without any user interaction" is pretty clear. If you say "maybe other programs have similar problems", sure, maybe they do. But Outlook definitely did (does?). RMN ~~~ |
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LRSeriesIII Aspiring Rocket Scientist Posts: 1128 Joined: 2002-08-29 |
#27953 Posted on: 03/29/2004 01:19 AM
To be fair, just because the malicious code can be executed without any user interaction does not mean that the vulnerability is an "unlockable door." I suppose an example of this would be the preview pane: by default it is on, and without the user doing anything malicious code can be executed. However, if the user gets rid of the preview pane (effectively locking that door), then the malicious code will not be executed. This is probably a really stupid question, but exactly which segment of the desktop market are we talking about Linux gaining ground in? Among power users? Corporate desktops? Average users? It seems to me that the challenges facing Linux are different for different segments of the desktop market. ->Computers ->Folding for team 3074 |
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rmn oh my, it's huge! Posts: 6013 Joined: 2002-01-26 |
#27954 Posted on: 03/29/2004 01:57 AM
Well, Linux is obviously gaining market share in the desktop segment... because it had almost no share to begin with.  Some companies and (mainly) local governments are starting to use Linux in "office" environments. For home use (read: games) and (especially) DCC, Linux still has a long way to go.
About Outlook (and MSIE), those are two separate problems, but both are problems. First, there are the "unlockable" holes (i.e., that don't depend on any user options), and then there's the fact that a lot of settings are insecure by default. You can't say "it's the user's fault because he didn't go into a sub-sub-sub-menu and change something he doesn't understand from the default setting". The default configuration should always be as secure as possible. And when the user changes something that brings a potential security risk, he should be informed of that. RMN ~~~ |
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AssKoala Anti-Zealot @ GATech Posts: 3309 Joined: 2002-01-02 |
#27955 Posted on: 03/29/2004 02:03 AM
I don't like Opera. I ran it for a while (about 4 days) then got tired of it. It's a bloated piece of trash. If I want tabbed browsing, I have SlimBrowser, which is just an IE based browser with added features. Works well, especially considering I dislike tabbed browsing most of the time as I'm only looking at one webpage at a time. I use it when I need to look at 10 pages at once, which is a rare occasion. The majority of the time, I use IE. One big deal people make with Opera is it has popup-blocking. Big *$#@ing deal. IE had it before that through various plug-ins. Now with SP2, its a default IE thing. I had it before that with the Google Toolbar and before that with AdShield. So no, Opera is not an end all. If you like it, fine. The majority of people I've talked to detest/dislike Opera. They prefer IE, Mozilla/Firefox/whatever the hell it is now, or other browsers. Me Webpage | If you always think like an expert, you'll always be a beginner. | "A handful of knowledgeable people is more effective than an army of fools" -Writing Secure Code, 2nd Ed. |
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AssKoala Anti-Zealot @ GATech Posts: 3309 Joined: 2002-01-02 |
#27956 Posted on: 03/29/2004 02:04 AM
Try the SP2 public beta. I haven't had any problems with it, been up without reboot since I installed it. Me Webpage | If you always think like an expert, you'll always be a beginner. | "A handful of knowledgeable people is more effective than an army of fools" -Writing Secure Code, 2nd Ed. |
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LRSeriesIII Aspiring Rocket Scientist Posts: 1128 Joined: 2002-08-29 |
#27957 Posted on: 03/29/2004 02:13 AM
I agree with you 110% on that. What I am really curious about is whether Novell will be targeting non-gaming home desktop use. Personally, I would guess that most home users do not play very many games, and that gaming is simply an after-thought when buying a computer for them. For gaming and DCC, it seems like Linux requires support from third party vendors to become a really viable option, thus Novell cannot do it on its own. For non-gaming home use, however, for the most part the applications are already out there (Mozilla, OpenOffice, etcetera...). However, you have to pry users away from a "MS Windows" only mentality, make your own system easy to use, and in general make some very interesting marketing moves. I am very curious as to whether this is what Novell intends to attempt. ->Computers ->Folding for team 3074 |
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nipster NOT a WarMonger Posts: 1841 Joined: 2001-09-12 |
#27958 Posted on: 03/29/2004 02:31 AM
I doubt it novell has never marketed to the general public I am kind of curious to see what happens with novell in the future having been a novell admin for years, I am glad the tide seems to be turning BACK towards acceptance of netware rather than a flood of people AWAY from it We are upgrading from NW51 to NW65 and possibly in the future may do the NDS/e-directory on top of linux thing which will be introduced with NW7. I always find it amazing when I talk to people who say how BAD netware is these are the same people who were using netware 3.x running the 16 bit netware client, which had its issues, along with some of the early client32's for windows 95 but since netware 5 (even a properly patched netware 4.x) it has been great NDS/e-directory is far superior to windows active directory in every aspect The netware core OS is far more secure and reliable than anything MS will ever be able to put out. The client, which seems to be the root of people's criticisms gets better with every release The only thing windows has on novell is that it is a little cheaper for licenses And for that, I say you get what you pay for... |
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dualboot_2xcpu hooked on sleeping pills Posts: 2397 Joined: 2001-07-16 |
#27959 Posted on: 03/29/2004 03:12 AM
nipster NOT a WarMonger Registered: Sep 2001 Location: Against the corporate greed and corruption of the Bush Administration Posts: 1337 Nipster is now l337. Back to the subject, I am also waiting to see how novell will do. alex I finally have SMP. Looking for the next Mrs. Right now (c) 2004. HEMI. |
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rmn oh my, it's huge! Posts: 6013 Joined: 2002-01-26 |
#27960 Posted on: 03/29/2004 05:26 AM
It's 3 MB.
That may have been a big deal when Opera introduced it, 4 years ago or so. Most Opera users have just taken it for granted (and I think all other browsers have adopted it now, haven't they?). Now, mouse gestures, zoom-in and zoom-out (with image resampling), site nicknames, fast-forward, etc., those have yet to make their way into the mainstream. Features that you don't even seem to be aware of, so I wonder what was the last version of this "bloated piece of trash" you've tried... 3.2 beta, perhaps...?
Amazing. I would expect the majority of people you know had never even heard of it, let alone try it, let alone have such a strong opinion about it as you say... :rolleyes: RMN ~~~ |
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AssKoala Anti-Zealot @ GATech Posts: 3309 Joined: 2002-01-02 |
#27961 Posted on: 03/29/2004 05:50 AM
It's a surprise if someone doesn't have strong opinions on what they use where I'm at. The majority of people I know completely detest Opera and uniquely run Firefox or Epiphany on their boxes. Then again, some of them insist that text-mode browsing is the be-all-end-all. I don't get into heated debates with them about whether what they use is better than what I use. That's idiotic. However, I don't go around making statements about how superior what I use is to their choice.
I'm talking about the UI. By default, its quite obtrusive and wastes a lot of screen real-estate.
I'm wondering why you're so pretentious as to assume I've never heard of those things? I'm not a big fan of mouse gestures, I don't see a need for them, but that's my opinion and preference. I'm not going to be pretentious enough to say you're too cheap to get extra mouse buttons. Because that's what I use and therefore anyone who doesn't is wrong. I've never needed to zoom-in or out, nor have I ever wanted to. When using Opera (and the last time I tried it was in a new Gentoo install about 2 weeks ago), I never found a use for zooming in and out. It was more of a "wow cool I can zoom in". Then forgotten and realized how useless it is to me. Mind you, I love the fact that Opera exists. It's very existence and success is proof that MS isn't a monopoly when it comes to browsers. After all, their browser is so out-dated that its not really anti-competitive is it? What do you want, MS to do everything new in IE so that you can post about MS being anti-competitive? Oh hell, God Forbid they innovate and get into another anti-trust suit as a dying tech company sues. Oh right, it also forces other browsers to meet their competition. Me Webpage | If you always think like an expert, you'll always be a beginner. | "A handful of knowledgeable people is more effective than an army of fools" -Writing Secure Code, 2nd Ed. |
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dualboot_2xcpu hooked on sleeping pills Posts: 2397 Joined: 2001-07-16 |
#27962 Posted on: 03/29/2004 05:52 AM
That over there kids is a rare specimen. He is a College student, kids, and a Computer Science major no less. Very caught up in his knowledge, we had better leave him to his own devices and not try and post or say anything that might conjure any new avanues of thought. ;) alex I finally have SMP. Looking for the next Mrs. Right now (c) 2004. HEMI. |
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AssKoala Anti-Zealot @ GATech Posts: 3309 Joined: 2002-01-02 |
#27963 Posted on: 03/29/2004 05:54 AM
Watch it. Me Webpage | If you always think like an expert, you'll always be a beginner. | "A handful of knowledgeable people is more effective than an army of fools" -Writing Secure Code, 2nd Ed. |
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KimVette Corvette Fanatic Posts: 945 Joined: 2002-07-30 |
#27964 Posted on: 03/29/2004 05:55 AM
Opera is bloated? Compare its footprint to NetRape, Internet Exploiter, or even Mozilla - Opera is tiny in comparison to the rest. They don't attempt to bundle everything under the sun with their browser. My configuration: Many hopelessly outdated SMP boxen. Any system which is shipping is already obsolete!
u r lame if u insist on trying 2 b l337 by abbrev evythng u type when asking ppl 4 hlp. kiddie speak is teh sux. ppl. plz stop teh kiddie speak. thx.
hint: aol kiddie speak is not cool, it just makes people not want to read your post. |
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dualboot_2xcpu hooked on sleeping pills Posts: 2397 Joined: 2001-07-16 |
#27965 Posted on: 03/29/2004 05:55 AM
Chuckle. I thought that would encite some anger. Nevertheless, as much as I would like to say it, it will take a miracle and some real hard work in one direction for linux to make it on the dekstop, and I think asskoala would agree that is too far fetched. alex I finally have SMP. Looking for the next Mrs. Right now (c) 2004. HEMI. |
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AssKoala Anti-Zealot @ GATech Posts: 3309 Joined: 2002-01-02 |
#27966 Posted on: 03/29/2004 05:56 AM
I was talking about the UI, it might not be clear in the second post I made. I don't like the UI, wastes space. Me Webpage | If you always think like an expert, you'll always be a beginner. | "A handful of knowledgeable people is more effective than an army of fools" -Writing Secure Code, 2nd Ed. |
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dualboot_2xcpu hooked on sleeping pills Posts: 2397 Joined: 2001-07-16 |
#27967 Posted on: 03/29/2004 06:02 AM
So what would you rather have? Console browsing? How do you browse the internet without a Gui of some sort? alex I finally have SMP. Looking for the next Mrs. Right now (c) 2004. HEMI. |
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rmn oh my, it's huge! Posts: 6013 Joined: 2002-01-26 |
#27968 Posted on: 03/29/2004 06:45 AM
Actually, you can get a version that comes with the Java installer. 
RMN ~~~ |
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rmn oh my, it's huge! Posts: 6013 Joined: 2002-01-26 |
#27969 Posted on: 03/29/2004 07:06 AM
Bloated UI...? Press F11 and you're in full screen mode. Everything works as usual (fast forward, mouse gestures, zoom-in and zoom-out, the wand, etc., etc., etc.). Can't get any less bloated than full screen, I think. If you want (some) menus (or a status bar, etc.), you can configure everything manually (just drag & drop the buttons and arrange the screen any way you like). You can even edit the contents and order of all the menus (including context menus), and customise all keyboard shortcuts. If you don't feel like rearranging the UI yourself, you can simply download one of hundreds of skins (you can even make Opera look almost exactly like MSIE). Apparently you didn't know any of this. How long did you spend using Opera? 20 seconds? :rolleyes:
My mouse has 10 buttons. I still use mouse gestures.
You see, the thing about innovation is that most people "never needed it" until someone came up with it. And after people get used to it, they start to find it hard to live without. Happened with pop-up blocking and MDI (tabbed browsing), which Opera introduced years ago, and will eventually happen with most of the features they've introduced since then (there's already some support for mouse gestures in Mozilla). Let me guess, you also have no need for nicknames, fast-forward, pop-up blocking, MDI or integrated translation, right...? Just out of curiosity, do you "feel the need" for anything that MSIE doesn't currently do?
:confused: Microsoft are free to do whatever they want with MSIE. If they ever make something that is better than Opera (in terms of speed, size, and / or UI power), maybe I'll use it instead. My only real problem with MSIE right now is that I'm paying for it and would rather not. Being anti-competitive is a business attitude, it has nothing to do with the software they make. RMN ~~~ |
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dualboot_2xcpu hooked on sleeping pills Posts: 2397 Joined: 2001-07-16 |
#27970 Posted on: 03/29/2004 07:15 AM
Waiting for this to spawn into personal attacks. alex I finally have SMP. Looking for the next Mrs. Right now (c) 2004. HEMI. |
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AssKoala Anti-Zealot @ GATech Posts: 3309 Joined: 2002-01-02 |
#27971 Posted on: 03/29/2004 08:14 AM
Understand what I said about too simple. This is opinion and preference.
Why should I spend the time? If IE has the style I want, why not use it?
Yes, 20 seconds. I'm glad you're such a good reader.
You must have missed the subtle point. I don't care for anything more than forward, backward, and click. I don't want anything else. I don't use anything more. You do, enjoy. That doesn't mean I'm wrong, that doesn't you're wrong.
You're right, that's the entire point of innovation. I'm saying that I personally don't care for Operas "innovations". This is my opinion and preference, it is the preference of many people. That's why there's so many relatively successful browsers out there isn't it? Me Webpage | If you always think like an expert, you'll always be a beginner. | "A handful of knowledgeable people is more effective than an army of fools" -Writing Secure Code, 2nd Ed. |
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rmn oh my, it's huge! Posts: 6013 Joined: 2002-01-26 |
#27972 Posted on: 03/29/2004 08:51 AM
So, do you feel the need for anything that the current version of MSIE doesn't do? Oh, and I'd say that calling full screen browsing "a bloated UI" is not "a matter of preference", it's "a matter of being in touch with reality". If you don't want to browse in full-screen, you don't have to, of course. But saying that a browser that lets you use 100% of the screen to display the pages has "a bloated UI" is just silly. RMN ~~~ |
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AssKoala Anti-Zealot @ GATech Posts: 3309 Joined: 2002-01-02 |
#27973 Posted on: 03/29/2004 09:16 AM
Well, first you misunderstood what I said. I said "too simple". To me Full Screen is not the way to work. That is, I like having those toolbars there onscreen. Please understand (or in this case read) what is clearly stated before trying to insult someone. As for what I want in IE. I wouldn't mind tabbed browsing, it'd be nice to not have to use Slim Browser to use the tabs. It'd probably be some sort of a toolbar, so I could unview it for the majority of the time. SP2 has pop-up blocking that is more obtrusive than I'd like. The google toolbar did a good job at it, so I guess I don't like the pop-up blocking that was added
Other than that, I'd say I'm happy with IE. It doesn't need to do anything more, that's why there are other browsers. Me Webpage | If you always think like an expert, you'll always be a beginner. | "A handful of knowledgeable people is more effective than an army of fools" -Writing Secure Code, 2nd Ed. |
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rmn oh my, it's huge! Posts: 6013 Joined: 2002-01-26 |
#27974 Posted on: 03/29/2004 08:40 PM
No, you said (and I quote): "I don't like Opera. I ran it for a while (about 4 days) then got tired of it. It's a bloated piece of trash." "I'm talking about the UI. By default, its quite obtrusive and wastes a lot of screen real-estate." "I don't like the UI, wastes space." So make up your mind. Is it "too bloated" or "too simple"? :confused: By default, Opera 7 actually displays the same elements as a default installation of MSIE (plus a banner, if your copy is unregistered). You can add or remove any element (icon, bar, panel, etc.) you like; the UI is fully customisable. Just right-click on the item you don't like and select "off", or click on "customise toolbars" and add the items you want (apparently you didn't know this, despite using it for "about 4 days"). You probably did exactly the same to MSIE's UI the first time you used it. All the things you want added to MSIE, Opera can do. Is there anything MSIE does that Opera can't, and which you need? RMN ~~~ |
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AssKoala Anti-Zealot @ GATech Posts: 3309 Joined: 2002-01-02 |
#27975 Posted on: 03/29/2004 11:45 PM
Your reading comprehension is terrible. I said Full Screen mode is too simple. You even posted that quote. Maybe I need to write like Dr. Seuss?
Yeah, IE doesn't have an ad banner. Nor do I need to pay $40 to get rid of said banner. Removing it from Windows wouldn't drop the price $40, so I guess I'd say IE is a deal. Me Webpage | If you always think like an expert, you'll always be a beginner. | "A handful of knowledgeable people is more effective than an army of fools" -Writing Secure Code, 2nd Ed. |
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